Some of you may or may not be surprised to hear that I’m not the only person who writes Gor novels! Chloe has informed me that a certain John Norman has a new book coming out in e-book form in May and in dead tree format in June.
Entitled ‘Avengers of Gor’ it’s book 36 in the official series and will be a Tarl Cabot pov tale (a rare enough thing these days).
Here’s the advance description:
AVENGERS OF GOR
Puzzling, disturbing rumours have reached Port Kar.
Tarl Cabot, warrior and merchant, pirate and slaver, once of Earth, now of Gor, learns that the Farther Islands, Thera, Daphna, and Chios, west of the Island Ubarates of Cos and Tyros, are being bloodily and systematically ravaged by corsairs supposedly led by himself, by Bosk of Port Kar, as he is commonly known.
How could this be? What is one to make of it? Why would so cruel and outrageous a hoax, apparently pointless, be perpetrated? Who would dare to do so?
And, in the meantime, shipping is assailed and towns and villages are looted and burned.
Tarl Cabot will investigate.
He will seek vengeance.
His quest will carry him to the taverns and palaces of corrupt, luxurious, decadent Sybaris, on Thera, where life is cheap and collared slave girls plentiful, where ruthless corsairs live by the sword and whip, and into strange and dangerous waters teeming with predatory vessels and monstrous sea life.
As the mystery is unravelled, bit by bloody bit, he discovers that its threads may reach far beyond the Farther Islands.
Kindle: 25/5/2021
Paperback: 10/6/2021
So, there are pink and purple sea dragons on Gor now? Huh.
ReplyDelete(Admittedly, both a better cover and a better creature than was on the last one, but that's a pretty low bar to cross)
Jack of Sterling
I suppose they're some breed of salt water aquatic tharlarion, Master. And yes, while that cover may not be a classic in itself, it's still much better than the previous one.
DeleteIf I was writing an 'Avengers of Gor' I think I'd deliberately include a Tony Stark style character in it...
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteI noticed slave girls are plentiful on Thera. This is reassuring at least. I agree the cover art is better than that for Quarry of Gor, which is faint praise. I suppose it's not bad except for the sea dragon.
ReplyDeleteIs there anywhere on Gor where slave girls aren’t plentiful? ;) It’ll be interesting to see what the far isles are like, culture wise.
DeleteI can't wait to see what happens when Tarl meets a very handsome Torvaldslander, an archer, a man dressed in Red white and blue tights, a meek fellow who gets a bit green when angry & a red haired kajira!
ReplyDeleteDon't forget the well dressed member of the Caste of Builders?
DeleteDoes this put to bed Emma's theory that Tarl is a long dead legendary warrior?
ReplyDeleteDonna
I think Emma remains a skeptic on that topic. She obviously doesn't believe in sea serpents.
DeleteI’m sure there was a ‘Tarl Cabot’ from Earth in the mid to late 1960s, but since then it’s been a shared name that Priest King agents use when they go about their business, to create the sense of this super-agent who is undefeatable. With each passing decade and each series of adventures that are written about, the legend of Tarl Cabot grows stronger and stronger, until he is now this elusive ‘bogeyman’ who defeats the Kurii at every turn.
DeleteThe real, original, Tarl Cabot probably retired shortly after Raiders of Gor, having never got over the humiliation of betraying his warrior codes and submitting in the marshes outside Port Kar. But the Priest Kings found the name useful and probably had other men take up the mantle. The published stories are there to promote the legend of the name. You’ll notice that in later books following the first six or so, Tarl Cabot is a very different man – very Gorean in his nature, as opposed to the more gentle and kind man depicted in the first six books.
Brinn disagrees with me of course and claims to have met Tarl Cabot. Or rather, a man who recently called himself Tarl Cabot. There have probably been several over the last sixty years or so.
Tal All,
ReplyDeleteVery Surprised to see a new book from Mr. Norman. Following this blog I recently became aware that he has many books written past the 1980's. Funny that Emma mentions Raiders of Gor, as I just finished that book a week ago. Since discovering her massive collection I started reading the Gor books in her off time to satisfy (barely) my addiction to her works. I started from the beginning and have been reading in sequence, now finishing Raiders. The next book is Captive of Gor, which was the very first Gor book I read, as a very young impressionable teenager. I am now torn, I really want to re-read it but I also want to continue on with Tarl's story. Interesting to hear Emma say that Tarl is a different or changed person in later books, more Gorean. I suppose that is to be expected after being on Gor for a long time. I have grown fond of his English/Gorean mixture, especially the parts where he falls in love with his slaves. Retiring in Port Kar as the wealthy Bosk would certainly be appealing.
I wonder what bookstores will have the new book on their shelves?
Richard Hardy
I often wonder what kind of occupation I will pursue when I get to Gor. Everyone thinks that the warrior life is the way to go. Having spent six years as a soldier, military life isn't really appealing. Something exciting like starting out small by renting a corner of a paga tavern to set up some gaming tables. Goreans love to gamble and I could progress quickly with the introduction of Craps, Blackjack and Roulette. Are there casinos on Gor?
ReplyDeleteWould there be any worth in setting up a postal delivery service, like say TarnExpress? Or how about inventing something simple like a Bic lighter. I constantly read about people starting fires with flint and steel. Would a lighter be too much for the Priest Kings?
I suppose I will also need a more Gorean name. Instead of Richard, maybe Riktarn or just use my last name Hardy? My mind is going off in tangents while we wait for more stories...
Richard
The waiting is the hard part, Richard. All your ideas sound interesting. Mikos said he wouldn't recommend getting into coffee smuggling, but I suspect he might just not want more competition ;)
DeleteI have never cared much for coffee, even though I like the smell of it brewing. I guess you don’t have to partake of the product to be a good smuggler. Smuggling is probably dangerous (and exciting!) so I think I will choose a safer profession. Smuggling requires a lot of trips back and forth. I wouldn’t want to get stuck on Earth if something got fouled up in the operation. Once I’m on Gor, I’m there to stay.
DeleteIn Chapter 6 of Conspirators of Gor, the protagonist was owned by an establishment on The Street of Chance in Ar. It appears to have been a casino.
DeleteI never understood why Goreans shipped girls over from Earth when the price of coffee (according to the early books) is vastly more profitable. Mikos is obviously the only one who has cottoned on to this.
DeleteIf a girl may be permitted to remark...
ReplyDeleteLike Master Richard, I have been re-reading some of the JN series while awaiting the next installment from the Emmaverse. I started with the Jason Marshall trilogy and with 'Kajira' (number 19) I ventured into unexplored territory. Although I'd faithfully purchased each new title back in the eighties, I'd never gotten around to reading the ones following the pair set in the Barrens.
Now that I've developed a skill for reading dense paragraphs really fast [yes, this girl understands biological realities, but she doesn't need to have them constantly pounded into her pretty head!] these 'middle' books are surprisingly enjoyable. Not as good as Emma's, but still pretty good.
It's an interesting thing. Mister Norman has succeeded in creating a compelling setting... populated with terribly undeveloped (in an emotional sense) people. Oh, and a simply *staggering* number of commas. So when the new book - complete with its pretty pink sea-tharlarion - becomes available I will put it on my reading list. But I know I won't enjoy it as much as anything that Emma chooses to write!
Pipa
Welcome to the comments section, Pipa. Avengers of Gor will be worth checking out, but I would expect repetition and ponderous sections of philosophical ramblings impeding the pace.
DeleteAgreed it will likely be a less enjoyable read than an Emma original.
Welcome Pipa!
DeleteWe both agree that JN has created quite the compelling setting, and that Emma is a better storyteller. I look forward to any new Gorean additions, even though I have a ways to go before reading them all.
Pretty sure you hit on the reason for his long hiatus after Magicians of Gor - it was the Great Comma Shortage of the 1990s.
DeleteMany thanks for the welcome, all. And thanks for the reminder, I had forgotten about the Great Comma Shortage! The lines at the punctuation shops... attempting to structure sentences so that commas wouldn't be needed... Those were dark days indeed for custom fonts.
DeleteFor anyone interested:
ReplyDeleteAmazon.com and Amazon.co.uk have Avengers of Gor (Book 36) available for pre-order in Kindle format for delivery on May 25. There is also a paperback version which is rather pricey.
Why does the Kajira have high heels?
ReplyDeleteAnd a little toomuch clothing for my liking?
I miss the time, long ago, when Gor covers had top rate artwork by Chris Achilleos and Boris Vallejo. I think we’ve lost the golden age of cover illustration in the publishing industry.
DeleteSad, but probably true, Emma. I also thought the cover art by Gino D'Achille for the American DAW editions was decent, but not quite up to the standards of Achilleos and Vallejo. I have also seen respectable cover art on some Russian editions of the Gor Novels.
DeleteWhy does the Kajira have high heels?
ReplyDeleteAnd a little toomuch clothing for my liking?
The little slut is exhibiting herself to gain a higher block price.
DeleteAnyway is it raining down in Wales, certainly is here?
I did like Pipa's remark about the Emmaverse.
The Kind and Gentle Lady Donna of Dover
Give the poor girl a break, Donna. She is chained to the mast ;)
DeleteUnknown....
DeleteIt is always raining here in Wales.
It rains more here than in Seattle. Very green where I live even though it is a former coal mining valley. These days it looks lively with no filthy rivers as in days gone by.
Frasier and Niles would get washed away here with all this rain.
Tal everyone,
ReplyDeleteI was just wondering. Who else is reading Avengers of Gor now? This could be the last one from JN I think.
Tracker said
DeleteI am. It includes this gem.
"Free Women are exalted and priceless," said Aktis
"Precisely," I (Bosk of Port Kar) said. "That is why they are such a bother. A Free woman is priceless because she has no price, and without a price she is worthless. A woman has no value until she is a slave and her value then is what the free will pay for her. It is only then a woman learns what she is truly worth, when she is taken off the block, when she is sold."
John Norman - Avengers of Gor (2021)
So far, John Norman has not bothered to make up any new names of Cities, they are all straight borrowings from the Greek Aegean.
And Emma of Gor's bold free women will like this, the city of Sybaris has free women who are so bold and brazen as to go about unveiled.
I am trying to, but after reading the below paragraph, that comes on the first page of the book, I got a migraine.
DeleteIt was obvious enough, but I wished my haggard, hollow-cheeked, wretched, despondent interlocutor, who had now sunk wearily to his haunches, not looking at me, to speak. One who speaks freely, unthreatened, of his own will, with no obvious motivation to lie, is more likely to tell the truth, even in its miserable plenty, than one intimidated, or one seeking profit by means of its distortion or concealment.
Clearly, the Great Comma Shortage had been resolved.
Jack of Sterling
Well guys, we know what to expect from JN by this time. I haven't had to resort to skimming the text at least. I will refrain from giving Avengers a thumbs up or thumbs down until I reach the end. I definitely have mixed feelings.
DeleteLooking forward to your review!
DeleteUnveiled women? Scandalous! I haven’t actually read Avengers of Gor yet. I did read the previous one, though. As everyone notes, the dead tree edition was very expensive, but seems to have come down in price now. Still not cheap, but better than it was.
DeleteI’m curious to know how many of you out there have read all of John Norman’s Gor books?
ReplyDeleteTracker says: I have read them all, except for Witness, which I skimmed, the book being, for me at least, unreadable.
DeleteEven I haven’t read them all. Books I still have to read are:
DeleteTarnsman of Gor
Savages of Gor
Blood Brothers of Gor
Dancer of Gor
Witness of Gor
Prize of Gor
Conspirators of Gor
Smugglers of Gor
Rebels of Gor
Plunder of Gor
Avengers of Gor
Quite a few there.
An interesting selection here. Four were missed out of the initial twenty-five, and of those four, three could easily stay missed. I enjoyed 'Dancer' despite one remarkable paragraph very early on which consumed (I believe) three full pages. It may be sacrilege to say so, but 'Tarnsman' really isn't very interesting. It's very much an ERB knock-off, and ERB is much better - at being ERB - than John Norman is. Numbers 17 and 18 add very little of enduring interest to the saga.
DeleteIt seems to me that you've been unlucky in choosing from the eleven 21st century titles. Here there are four that you have read... and sadly most of them are among the weaker offerings. 'Kur' is the exception, being (to my mind) the kurii version of the Nest War. 'Swordsmen' and 'Mariners' are - I think - the worst of the entire series, and 'Quarry' as I have remarked elsewhere is a train wreck (although at times an entertaining one).
The seven remaining 'newer' books are a mixed bag. None of them are awful (provided 'Witness' is read using the chapter order I've suggested elsewhere in this thread) and two of them ('Rebels' and 'Avengers') are quite good. So if you've only got time to read two more JN books, you now know which ones to chase down. :-)
Of the original 25 books, there were quite a few other gaps in the list before I began writing my own stories and knuckled down to a bit of a catch up. All my books are second hand copies, bought long after the series went out of print, and so initially I was limited to what I could actually find in a second hand bookshop (and we’re talking about the 1990s before eBay made such things easier). I remember Dancer of Gor was nigh on impossible to find for example (though I now have a copy of it – looks like a sparkling unread copy, too, which must be hard to find in that condition). Magicians of Gor was the Holy Grail of finds because it had never been published in the UK. I didn’t get that book until eBay made it possible to buy a copy from the USA. In the case of Tarnsmen I think I passed on it because I knew it wasn’t typical of the Gor books I did like – as you say, much more of an ERB pastiche than later books. Blood Brothers got a pass for so long because (in the UK at least) it has a truly garish cover, and Savages, well, I don’t know why I haven’t read that one yet. Possibly because it linked in to Blood Brothers. I should take a look at them sometime.
DeleteTracker Says: Well I finished Avengers about ten days ago and have been thinking about it.
ReplyDelete1. It is almost pure adventure. Hardly any philosophy, not above 5-10%, including ruminations on slaves. Most of the philosophy is presented as dialogue rather than monologue - and hardly above a page at a time, and relevant to the actual story, which makes it much more digestible.
2. There is a nice twist at the end, which leads into a possible next book. And as was said of Tarl in Assassins of Gor, (which I just finished re-reading) Tarl/Bosk is not a Player - that is a deep or discerning strategist - he is a warrior and tactician.
3. The adventure parts of the campaign are well written (except for some convoluted dialogue) but there is so much of it! Really really a lot of. There could be fewer incidents or they could be written more concisely. This is particularly glaring, since I was reading Assassins at much the same time.
There was of course an Earth Girl slave, even at the far end of the Gleaming Thassa. Tarl/Bosk's penis acts almost as a dowsing rod to finding earth girls, even from Pasangs away, but she is not too intrusive.
All in all, not a bad book unless one is looking for pages and pages of philosophy, or slave girls who will just not shut up about their love of the collar.
Tarl’s Penis = dowsing tool for locating Earth girls. That made me laugh. :)
DeleteTal,
ReplyDeleteAfter some initial misgivings, possibly exacerbated by the cover art, I must say I liked "Avengers of Gor" overall . JN checks the requisite boxes for fans of the Gorean Saga with this offering. Will he gain any new readers with Book 36? Not likely I think because of his writing style. Great literature it's not. However it is an entertaining, engaging and fun (for fans of Gor) tale.
I agree with Tracker on the topic of philosophical ramblings and slave girl 'feelings'. Those elements were much more subdued than expected and didn't overly intrude on the story itself.
Tarl/Bosk encounters a Barbarian girl who was formerly a wealthy, privileged young lady of Earth. She was apparently a natural slave in her former life and hasn't yet fully learned her slavery on Gor. How fortunate for her that Bosk of Port Kar finds her. ✔
Three free Gorean women are tricked into enslaving themselves at a later point. Since they are greedy, selfish and dishonourable types, this outcome seems fitting and even satisfying. ✔
JN combines action, adventure, mystery and intrigue in sufficient detail to keep the story lively.✔
Yes, there is an unexpected plot twist at the end which sets up the premise for the next book. The author is 90 years of age so I don't know how many more of these we can expect. Enjoy them while you can.
I give Avengers 3.5 tarns out of 5.
We are getting closer to the day when I suppose there will be no more official Gor novels any more. As you say, Mr Norman has just turned 90, and most of his generation of writers passed away quite some time ago. It makes that long period from the late 1980s to the early 2000s when he was blacklisted and couldn’t find a publisher, all the more heart-breaking, as we would probably have had a book a year during that period.
DeleteThis girl has not (yet) read all of the books but she's trying very hard. I recently finished with the stories from the 'middle years' and moved on to the twenty-first century. I did so with some trepidation, because I had no idea what to expect.
ReplyDeleteI was particularly concerned with the earlier comment suggesting that 'Witness' might be unreadable. A few pages into the book I was afraid that correspondent might be right but, plucky kajira that we are, we endured. And the persistence proved worthwhile, I thought. Yes, the first seven chapters - which alternate between flashback and look-ahead - are frustrating. But from chapter eight onward, JN gets on with it, and it's not a bad yarn. As an experiment (for someone who is super bored) it might be worth reading in this order: chapters 2, 4 & 6 to start, then 8 through 40. Then insert 1, 3, 5, and seven before resuming with 41 and continuing to the end.
I started 'Prize' (number 27) last night and soon ran into the following sentence: 'Perhaps she had met such gazes before from such as the older woman, gazes, and stares, and such, perhaps of envy, hatred, and hostility, the cold, fixed gazes and stares of women whose youth and beauty were behind them, and who seemed to wish to do little now but resent and castigate, and scorn, the possessors of the treasures now forever lost to themselves, the pleasures, fruits and ecstasies of which they, in their own time, had been denied, or had denied themselves; perhaps they had been the unwitting victims of politically motivated secular asceticisms; perhaps they had been tricked out of their own birthright, having been led to accept a voluntary unrealized incarceration, taught to make themselves miserable, grieving, self-congratulating prisoners, required to pretend to contentment within the bars, within the cold walls, of an inhibitory value system; perhaps they were merely the unhappy, cruelly shaped, psychologically deformed products of an engineered apparatus, one designed to take natural organisms, bred for open fields, and grass and sunlight, and force them into the prepared, procrustean niches of a pervasive, self-perpetuating, invisible social mechanism, into a titanic, neuteristic architecture of human deprivation, and social expediency.'
The sentence, large and powerful, survived the collision better than I did, for I am a mere girl, small and weak. What could I do, besides allowing myself to be overpowered? And so I was mastered by the sentence, my breath taken away; I could hear it whistling out the open window in chorus with with that monstrous regiment of commas...
But there is a story buried under the juggernaut sentences, and I'm finding it rather entertaining!
Thank you Tracker and Mick for review of Avengers. I am tempted to read it next and break away from my progression of reading the books in chronological order. I have almost 30 books to go and I guess it will take me several years. I do enjoy them and I look forward to all of the gorean imagery along the way.
ReplyDeleteThank you Pipa for staying the course with ‘Witness’ and your recommendation; I will not be skipping it. That quote was, well, extraordinary. I’m not sure what to make of it! Definitely another abuse of commas and even semicolons this time! Thank you for sharing.
I also look forward to reading everything that our precious Emma has to offer. I hope that her wonderful contributions become as prolific as JN. The quality of her work already surpasses his and is worth the wait. We don’t want to rush quality, and I have plenty to read in the meantime.
Richard Hardy
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteJust read the above book. I really liked for a change in the authors meandering prose in previous books. I certainly did not want to spend $35 on an overpriced paperback. As I live in Broward county Florida I signed into the Count library and downloaded it for free ( note they also have about 16 other JN Gor books on file. Check with your local library's catalogs. I had about 2 weeks to read before it went away, free is free ORIGINAL DUCK
ReplyDeleteOn line copy of "AVENGERS OF GOR"
ReplyDeletehttps://readfrom.net/john-norman/593639-avengers_of_gor.html
Emma,
ReplyDeleteIs that you being one of the narrators on the page mentioned above?
Donna
When will be getting a new story or an update on current tales ?
ReplyDeleteNeed an "EMMA" BOAST.
It's been a long cruel Summer.
ReplyDeleteTal all,
ReplyDeleteI think Emma has about 6 stories to finish off and keep us all entertained.
I see Chloe dishing out some prolonged periods of latrine duty to blond barbarian slave girl as an incentive for that blond barbarian to do some work.
Donna
This girl has FINALLY completed her reading (or re-reading) of the cycle. The first 13 were revisited about 8 years ago before my attention went elsewhere. So my re-reading this year began with 'Fighting Slave' and continued through 'Blood Brothers'; everything after that was new material to me. As others have observed, they are a mixed bag, especially the ones from the present century.
ReplyDeleteThe pair set in the Barrens (from back in the eighties) had been my previous non-favorites. Unfortunately, they were easily supplanted by 'Swordsmen' and 'Mariners' which I found utterly dreadful. Anybody attempting a full reading could skip those two without missing anything important. Happily the books rebound after that. 'Conspirators' and 'Smugglers' are interesting if not brilliant, and 'Rebels' (#33) is exceptional.
'Plunder' and 'Quarry' also fall into the interesting-but-not-brilliant category. Chronologically, I believe these are nearly simultaneous, which is interesting; this is also true of 'Swordsmen' (29) and 'Smugglers' (32). I felt 'Quarry' was marred by more than its awful cover. The plot was - to my eyes - an utter train wreck. Despite that, I enjoyed reading it.
Which brings me to 'Avengers'. I thought the new effort was quite good. As Master Mick has observed, it checks off all the boxes. The omission of mountains of philosophy resulted in a read that is crisply paced. It is also (I believe) the shortest of the novels since 'Savages' (#17). Several have remarked on the 'twist' at the end regarding the girl once known as 'Talena'. I believe this was included to clear up the confusion which was left smoldering at the end of 'Quarry', and yes it does suggest that the Hero will return for further adventures.
On that topic... Yes, Mister Norman is now in his 91st year so such expectations may be unrealistic. However, this girl's intuition is whispering to her that JN was perhaps not the SOLE author of 'Avengers'. This effort was far too 'clean', and the man does have children (whom we will assume are literate). I suspect he has sketched out some further adventures which may be left for somebody else to complete.
On the subject of the 'real' Tarl Cabot... I am not entirely comfortable with the idea of a succession - contrived by the Priest Kings - of Cabots. We frequently see in the middle and later books a TC whose relationship with the Priest-Kings is at best ambiguous. And the ending of 'Avengers' reminds us that he is subject (somewhat) to having his heartstrings pulled. I'm also intrigued by the character of 'Alan', the mysterious red-haired warrior who helps (in best deus ex machina fashion) save the day at the end of 'Quarry'.
Finally, this cruise through the cycle has been entertaining in its way. But one thing appears in very sharp relief... Out of all the characters in all the books, there are few (if any) that I found myself caring about. Not the way I care (whether it's love or hate) about the people Emma has shared with us. And that, kind Masters and Mistresses, is her shining achievement.
And no, I was not paid to say that.
Thank you, chain-sis. I take pride in my characters (and dialogue), probably more than anything else, and I’m glad so many readers find them appealing enough to care about them one way or another. Mr Norman has written some memorable characters in his time, but sadly they are often not the main narrators of the novels (leaving aside Tarl). As the series progresses the female narrators seem to become complete doormats from the earliest chapters, hardly putting up any resistance to their predicament, and simply acting as witnesses to the events going on around themselves. I’ve tried to take the opposite approach. My narrators may ultimately be just as submissive, but they tend to have a lot more fight in them, which adds some character conflict as they struggle against what they’re going through. Personally I feel that makes for a more interesting read.
DeleteBrinn believes in the one true Tarl Cabot. He claims to have met him. But to be honest, Brinn is so gullible I once convinced him that sleen can’t look up, and that if you were hiding in the trees, they wouldn’t be able to crane their necks far enough to spot you. He had to double check with his sleen handler, who simply laughed at him and rewarded me with a chewy candy.
And wow, you must be a fast reader to have worked through ALL those books. Obviously your Master isn’t giving you enough chores to do. ;)
DeleteSshhhh! I was sent to tidy up the pantry, and everybody else in the house has been 'oohing' and 'ahhing' over the new girl that FedEx delivered on Tuesday - redhead, of course - and nobody's missed me. I've been perched on the window sill, reading, all week.
DeleteHopefully nobody will look too closely at the state of the pantry, or if they do, they'll forget I was the one detailed to improve it. Hopefully.
Tracker says. Interesting comments.
ReplyDeleteI do not have any trouble in believing in the one Tarl theory. I believe that due to the stabilization serums that it is entirely possible for one hero to have all these adventures. I believe the time line is even longer though. I think for example that Tarnsman took place in the 1930s earth time with progression from there. I think Captive took place in the late 40s and Slave Girl in the mid-50s (due to the earth college mileau).
2. Emma does indeed write many interesting characters ( I just wish she would give us more to enjoy)
3. What was your opinion of Kajira? I am re-reading it now and it is way better than I had remembered. 55% thru and more action and less philosophy than I remembered. I am enjoying more than I would have thought.
My own thoughts on Kajira of Gor, Master: it has a great set-up with Tiffany being recruited to impersonate an evil Tatrix as an insurance option, and features some very hot scenes (I’ve always loved the sequence where Tiffany disguises herself as a slave in order to see the slave pens) but I don’t think the second half of the book is as strong as the first half. The best bits for me are when she is impersonating the Tatrix and gradually begins to realise she has no actual power and things are falling apart around her. The second half isn’t bad, but it isn’t as good as the first half.
DeleteInteresting thoughts regarding the timeline. 'Tarnsman' set in the '30s? Or the '60s? From our 2021 vantage point, 1965 is much more like 1935 than the present! I will give this suggestion further consideration as I refresh my readings of numbers 1-13.
ReplyDeleteI enjoyed 'Kajira' quite a lot, but I have always found myself drawn to the stories allegedly presented from a female point of view. This holds true even when the narrators repeatedly prove themselves to be... ninnies. That I persistently overlook that quality may - in the opinion of some - qualify ME as a ninny, but I can't help that. They are entitled to their opinions, even if they're wrong.
In any case, I thought the idea of Tiffany as an unwitting doppelganger for the tyrannical Sheila was an interesting twist.
Tal Pipa and Tracker,
ReplyDeleteSomething occurred to me regarding the timeline of Captive of Gor. When Elinor flees NYC after her initial capture, she is wearing bell bottom slacks and a bare midriff blouse. This is certainly not 1940s fashion. Bell Bottoms became the fashion for both sexes in London in the 1960s and then spread to the rest of Europe and North America.
Captive was first published in 1972. Based on the important clue of Elinor's clothing, the Earth timeline for the events in Captive most likely would have fallen in the range from the 60s to the early 70s.
Just catching up with all the old comments on this thread! For the purpose of my stories, I treat books 1 to 25 of the John Norman saga as occurring one year prior to the publication date. So to my mind, Elinor Brinton is brought to Gor in 1971 (bell. bottom slacks and bare midriff blouse and flat ironed blonde hair and all) with her tale being widely disseminated in 1972. I treat many of the books 26 onwards that deal with the Ar/Cos war as probably occurring shortly after book 25 (to account for the publishing gap in what appears to be a fast moving story) with possibly the later volumes reverting back to one year before publication. That makes the Gor series commencing in 1965, and the Priest King civil war of book 3 occurring in 1967.
DeleteIf you are familiar with JN’S book “NOMADS OF GOR” one of the key characters was “DINA of TURIA”.
ReplyDeleteNot only did she win for him “capture races” but was a loyal slave girl, which he freed and let her return to her city.
I believe that there is and could be a very good “spin off” tale her written by the right author like you.
After Dina is freed by Tarl and she returns to her city and tries to reestablish her bakery she is styimed by the slaver who is running Turia.
In the book Tarl sneaks into the city under a guise as a Jewel merchant who is discovered and is hidden by Dina.
In the story Tarl and Dina have multiple sexual liaisons.
HERE IS WHERE A SPIN OFF STORY BEGINS:
Unknown to Tarl, Dina becomes pregnant with a man child and he is never informed of it.
Tina reestablishes her bakery.
She has a healthy red headed baby boy. Named Tarl of Turia
She marries a baker and has other children.
At the age of 14 she realizes that Tarl is something special and will become a great warrior like his father.
She contacts Kamchak of the Tuchuks and asks him to train the boy in the weapons/ways and traditions of the Wagon Peoples.
Four years later he goes to a city to learn/train to be a warrior who wears the Scarlet.
The tale from here could divert into many directions
Does he look for his father ( Dina has told him of his heritage) ?
Does he go off on other adventures to make a name for himself ?
This could be a great diversion from your normal stories ( which I think are great and I can’t wait for more)
It would really show off your excellent writing skills
The bottom line is Tarl Cabot has hundreds of liaisons over the years and I cannot believe he never sired any offspring.
What do you think ? I don’t know any other writers who could pull this off , Do you ?
Thanks
Tracker wrote:
ReplyDeleteTarl of Turia
I
Tarl of Turia, son of Dina the Baker and First Tarnman of Turia sat late into the night, thinking. He was the founder of the Tarn Cavalry of Turia, his tarns ranging far over the plains, claimed by both Turia and the Wagon Peoples. His duties were two fold. One to guard the caravans on which Turia’s trade, its lifesblood depended, and second to watch the Wagon Peoples in the migrations. His four strong squadrons, each 125 strong added greatly to the strength of his city. But now, with Caravan High Season over, and the Wagon Peoples not due for a season and half, one squadron in rotation sufficed for the Caravan Duty. He had a season and more to pursue a personal duty, finding his father Tarl Cabot of Ko-ro-ba. His pondering was where he should search this season.
As he pondered, by the light of two dim lamps, his eyes fell on a schendi slave girl, sleeping on her side, chained to the foot of his couch. The lamps picked out the highlights of her body beautifully. The sweet breast, the narrow waist, the trim bottom, her luxurious love pouch with the small triangle of curly hair. The hollows in her lower back, her slave dimples between her waist and bottom caught and reflected the light. Surely, he thought, the mark of a true slave.
Slaves, Tarl reflected, were likely the most travelled group on all Gor. While most free men and women barely left their cities and towns or holdings, maybe once for the mandatory pilgrimage to the Sarder, slaves were traded all over the land mass. Soldiers of the City trained bands and militias might travel to their adjacent cities surrounding them, which of course they were at war, or even to the next circle of cities, their natural allies against the first circle which surrounded them. Merchants would travel from city to city, but only along one road or seaway, strung like slave beads on a string, but they would not much deviate from that route. Even pirates and seafarers tended to follow routes that would set. In the cities they traded with other merchants whose other routes took them to the central trading cites.
But the slaves, they were traded all over Gor, from city to city, region to region. Men, true men, desired all women and craved novelty, so women were traded often; from master to master, city to city, region to region. Even a beloved slave who became a love slave to a single master, might find herself traded away in a quest for novelty
Tarl contemplated the Schendi girl at his feet. She bore a Tuchak brand; what pilgrimage had brought her from faroff Schendi to be enslaved by the Wagon Peoples. And what journeys had she been on since. He had taken her in an attack on a group of caravan raiders, but they had not taken from the Wagon Poeples. She knew the love dances and ways of pleasing a man from several cities. Yes, he thought, she had travelled to and fro on the surface of Gor, for slave women were merchandise and wealth. They were sometimes carried by tarn or in wagons if they were lucky, but mostly wealth on the hoof, trod the dusty roads of Gor, their naked feet kicking up dust onto their naked bodies, arms braceleted behind their backs, collars connected by chains into a coffle.
Tarl of Turia turned his mind from the travels of the slaves, to his own travels across Gor in search of his father, Tarl Cabot of Ko-ro-ba
To be continued.
off to a good start...
DeleteTracker says:
DeleteThank you. I am good at starting stories, let us see if I can carry on long enough to interest Emma in taking it up.
Great start, I see this as the beginning of a new set of tales. I hope Emma would jump on the wagon and use her writing talents to make this a complete story. When I posted this I really hoped that she would take up the challenge. As this was my original story idea I would like it to be an "Open Universe" for any GOOD writer to expand in all directions. ORIGINAL DUCK
DeleteSadly, my problem is not so much lack of ideas for novels to write, but hours in the day to write them all! I have, believe me, lots of ideas for stories with all manner of narrators, some of which have been hanging in conceptual limbo for quite some time now. Will I ever get round to using my ideas for an adventure in the frozen northlands? I don’t know. I was delighted to read the excerpts of Tarl of Turia below, though, as it’s rare for me to see anyone else’s stories in the Gor milieu. There are fragments dotted around the Internet, but more often than not they are either aborted first chapters or simply short set pieces with a very basic BDSM encounter. You can imagine how Olga’s ‘Daughter of Gor’ was such a surprise when I first ran into it.
DeleteTracker wrote
ReplyDeleteTarl of Turia II
Tarl of Turia
From the Wagon Peoples to the Sardar.
When Tarl of Turia was thirteen, his mother Dina the Baker talked to him like an adult. It is time for you to have serious training in the ways of men, in the ways of weapons and in the ways of the world of Gor. Your stepfather is a good man and one of the leaders of the caste of bakers, but he is not the man to teach you these things. I propose that a higher destiny awaits the son of Tarl Cabot and have asked the leaders of the Tuchaks of the Wagon Peoples if they will teach you the ways of weapons and wars. They are the enemies of Turia but much can be learned from them.
We live in need of them, to buy our goods and to keep other cities from springing up to rival us on the plains of Turia. They need us to supply them with the manufactured goods items from far away they cannot make on the plains. We need each other, and yet are rivals as each struggles for mastery, which is the way of men. Now go, and make your father proud.
Tarl had had enough of having his absent and semi-mythical father held over him. He was thirteen and was sure he knew all that he needed. He was big for his age and the leader of a gang of boys who swaggered the streets in his quarter of Turia. What a shock the Wagon Camps were!
From the leader of his friends in Turia, among the wagons he became the least. The things that they were good at, he was untaught and unskilled. His city knowledge was useless, and worse, despised and derided. He lost most of his small bundle of possessions in unwise, foolish bets. He bragged, and then could not back it up. He was lost. But he persevered. His soft baker’s boy body became lean and hard. He learned the ways of the Kailla and the Bosk. He made sure the wheels of the wagons were greased, and the Bosk healthy. Harold, the commander of a Thousand taught him swordplay and he was a quick student.
Tarl spoke less and listened much more. He was surprised to find that the less he spoke the wiser he was considered; the more he listened to others, the more they thought of him. This and other things he considered in the quiet times at night watching the herds and the great wide skies.
And he had his first woman. Her name was Mina, that was the name her master put on her. She had been a high Lady of Glorious Ar, but was now just a pierced nose slave of the Wagon peoples. Her master gave him the use of Mina, and Tarl reveled in it. But after three weeks, Mina was gone, lost in a wager by her master to a Hundred Commander of the Paravici. Tarl was crushed, though he strove to hide it. He promised himself he would win her back. But the peoples separated; and he never saw her again. What he found instead was Ruby, a barbarian from a place called Earth. She was short where Mina had been tall, slim where Mina had been busty, and yet also a slave, soft and yielding, hot in the furs and exciting to his senses.
Tarl learned several things. Woman had infinite variety of physical forms, and were infinitely enchanting. They were all different; and yet in many essentials were much the same. They cried out for a master to whom they could yield, and yet would use their beauty to dominate men, if men were not strong. Tarl loved women in their variety, and loved them more in their yielding. He was growing up.
Over four years Tarl heard stories of the man Tarl Cabot, of his skill with weapons, his mastery of beasts, beasts of ground like Bosk and Kailla, beasts of the air, such as the magnificent Tarn, and the beast of the furs, the kajirae of Gor. He would watch the great Tarns for hours, wild, untamed, vicious beasts, yet bendable to the will of a strong, brave, and determined men. He listened to the stories of the old warriors, describing the tactics of the Tarn Cavalry, and the tactics the wagon peoples used against them. The old men, their bones growing colder as they aged, delighted to have someone listen to their stories. Tarl listened and he learned. He had thought that Turia would need its own Kailla cavalry to remain free and proud, but now he dreamed of Turian Tarnsmen, replacing the unreliable mercenaries, Turian Tarnsmen soaring above the caravan routes protecting the trade of Turia, bringing early news of threats. For now they were only the dreams of a young man.
ReplyDeleteAgain and again Tarl heard stories of Tarl Cabot, he learned that Tarl Cabot was not just the remembrances of a foolish woman for a long ago companion, but a hero to men as well. He resolved to live up to his heritage, to become a worthy son of Tarl Cabot. How is mother would have laughed, were so not such a wise woman.
It was only later, when Tarl of Turia would hear exaggerated stories of his own exploits that he learned how legends grew in the telling, how the number of vanquished foes multiplied and the difficulties and the cunning of the hero increased, but that was in the future.
It was after four years that Tarl, leaner, wiser, more skilled, seventeen and proud, resolved to leave the Wagon Peoples and make his pilgrimage to the Sardar. He craved knowledge, believing that there was power in knowing. He left with the best wishes of the Wagon Peoples, his weapons, his knives, his rope, his dreams and a slave girl named Kasia. As he journeyed to the Sardar, he kept his dreams, his weapons, and his own counsel, listening and learning where others spoke carelessly and boastfully. He learned more of them than they did of him. Kasia he sold and bought other women, usually making money as he went. For he loved slave women in the variety, not being especially attracted by just one physical form, knowing them to be much the same in their needs. When a man was particularly aroused by a woman he owned, Tarl would sell at a premium, and buying whatever shape or colour was common on the market. Tall or short, slim or buxom, he would enjoy their yielding, their pleas, their helpless cries of love. And for now, on his journey to the Sardar, Tarl was content.
I really liked the 2 tacks the above writers have chosen. Like when I first posted my ideas RE: Tarl of Turia there is a good tale to be told. Original Duck
ReplyDeletePossible story line --> at 14 Tarl goes to train under Tuchuks, He befriends Kamchaks son ( mother was Apris of Tura ) They train under Harold of the Tuchuks. At the age of 18 they leave to go to Koroba to train to be warriors with the ultimate goal of being Tarnsmen. The adventure can spin off in many directions. Initial story should deal with Tarl 's life with the Tuchuks, then training to be a warrior. Then flesh out on his various quests with Kamchaks son who needs to earn the Courage scars.
ReplyDeleteAbove is story line suggestion by Original Duck
DeleteEMMA, I really think that you would have the most talent to write a multichapter story of Tarl of Turia. This seal your writing abilities where instead of having a female protagonist you would have a male one. Of course, you would have Tarl and his friend have many escapades with slaves. Perhaps with Elizabeth Cardwell as Tarl searches for his father. One or 2 chapters of his life with the wagon peoples, then training to be a Tarnsman, escapades and adventures, etc.
ReplyDeleteOriginal Duck